The Resilience Revelation: How Recovery Fuels Our Strength with Nancy Medoff

Embracing the ebb and flow of life's relentless pace, bestselling author and speaker Nancy Medoff joins me, Minessa Konecky, for an insightful conversation that's sure to reframe your perception of resilience. You'll feel the tension ease from your shoulders as we navigate the landscape of self-care, sharing stories of how the art of recovery is not just a counterbalance to burnout but a foundation for thriving in both personal and professional spheres. Our exchange extends an invitation to you, the listener, to redefine the way you approach rest and productivity.

This episode invites you into the heart of our reflections, where memories walk hand in hand with mindfulness. Discover the transformative power of regular walks, quality sleep, and setting boundaries, not as mere strategies for enhanced output, but as cornerstones of a fulfilling life. Nancy and I ponder on how these small, yet intentional choices ripple out to create a richer, more vibrant existence.

Finally, step behind the curtain to see how setting clear boundaries with clients and partners is crucial in maintaining not just our sanity, but our creative integrity. I'll reveal strategies from my professional playbook on managing expectations and upholding the sacred space where our best work comes alive. Wrapping up with the successes and inspirations drawn from Nancy's Cape Cod retreat, we underscore the continued journey of growth and the importance of staying connected with mentors who champion our evolution. Join us for an episode that not only illuminates these vital themes but also emboldens you to take the actions that return you to your best self.

CONNECT WITH NANCY

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CONNECT WITH ME MORE AT:
http://www.stopshoulding.me
https://www.instagram.com/minessa.konecky/

🎵 Thank you to Karacter for allowing me to use Telepathy (2005) in my intro.
This is one of my favorite albums of all time.
👉 Check it out: https://karacter.bandcamp.com/album/karacter

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:03

Hello there, I'm Vanessa Konnicki, and this is Stop Shitting All Over Yourself a show to remind you that you do know what you're doing and you are enough just as you are. Each episode, I connect with an incredible human being who has walked the path that you're on, the path that leaves other people's expectations for who you're supposed to be and the decisions that you're supposed to make by the wayside, To replace those ideas with a blueprint for your life that you design. These stories will inspire you and their tactics will help you to lay the bricks on the road to a happier and more joyful you, as always. Thank you so much for listening and, if you're on YouTube, drop a like or subscribe to get all the feel good content from Vanessa TV.

Speaker 1: 0:47

And now let's listen in as I have a conversation with Nancy Medoff, bestselling author of the book Unmute Yourself Speak Up to Stand Out, Keynote Speaker, podcast host and a world model for anyone who's trying to find their voice and stand up for themselves in corporate America. She has had such a busy 2023, I am so thrilled she was able to join us to talk about her philosophies on using rest and recovery to build resilience, which is in sharp contrast to our hustle culture. Today, In this conversation, we dove into some serious shit, not the least of which is revisiting work's dominance in our culture and in our worth. Let's listen in and see what she said. It's so good and it's all about understanding how important rest is in our lives.

Speaker 2: 1:34

So this is a great segue. So I'm getting ready for a keynote and it's a newer topic for me. It's authentic leadership, which I can speak on that. But, and resilience, and when I do a keynote, like I'm not going to get up there and make shit up, Like I need to do the research. So I'm doing the research and I'm like, okay, resilience, blah, blah, blah. And what I found recently now this is not, you know, I just found this like this week is that and this is a Harvard business review study that people think about resilience and they think about grit, like in the Marine Corps, and the grit and the grind and it's actually not Truly resilient people. They recover. I was going to say rest, they recover. So if you're in the performance zone, you need to give as much time in the recovery zone. And this article talks about facts and data that supports that. And I think about that and I'm like, I think about, I thought about this story because I used to travel a lot more than I do now I still travel a lot and I remember I would be on the plane, right, Vanessa, and I would get on a Wi-Fi and I would be like, okay, just one more second blah, blah, blah, blah, right, and then I would close my laptop, I would get in the cab and I would boot up my laptop again and I would use my phone.

Speaker 2: 3:02

I'd use the Wi-Fi from my phone to send out all the emails and I'm like what are you doing? And I remember I was talking to a friend and she said I don't remember what the context was, but what I heard was she reads on the plane, like casual reading, Like nonfiction, like fiction, Fiction. She checks her bag, which I thought was interesting, and I'll get to that in a second. And she did one more thing. So I remember I was like, wow, so I took a flight and I'm like I'm not going to do any work. And it was awesome. It was like, imagine the like two and a half hours you can't be reached, You're not working, or three hours, whatever. And I read, you know, I caught up on magazines, whatever. And I started thinking about how am I going to thrive on the road? I want to thrive on the road, thrive on the road, thrive on the road, because I was on the road all the time. So that's, I started doing that and that, in essence, is the recovery piece. I mean it was interesting. It was. It was interesting Like I used to go to Vegas.

Speaker 2: 4:09

I used to go to Vegas and I would take the most possible quickest flight out of there that I could. So if the trade show, I did it like three, I'd be on a five pm flight out and I fine, just get me home. And then I'm like why am I doing this? So I started staying and I would book a spa appointment. You know, four days on on my feet in a row at a trade show, and then I'm getting on the plane, I'm sleeping on the plane, it might be delayed. I get back home. You know, I'm not like resting when I get home, dealing with everything at home. I'm like noob.

Speaker 2: 4:41

So I invited some friends who were there at the conference with me and I'm like, let's stay an extra day, let's go, let's have a nice dinner and go to the spa. So we did. And then the next morning I would get on a plane and I would use my company's time to fly home, Like why am I sacrificing my sleep to get home? You know, it's, it's um, it's interesting. So then this, this many years later, for me to read and realize, as I'm doing this research that resilience is tied to recovery. Yeah, I'm like that. That makes a. That makes a shit ton of sense.

Speaker 1: 5:16

You know what else makes a lot of sense. Actually, you said. You said that as like I had this moment right. Okay, so think about this human body. If you're going to go and work out, you're never going to work out five days in a row. The same muscle, constantly doing higher and heavier weights, because any trainer, we all know that that's a surefire way to injure yourself physically and get you to a point where you can't work out for months, where you need surgery, right.

Speaker 1: 5:42

And what's interesting is, I think that for the last several decades, I would say I would say that, like several decades ago, the conversation about work started, where we're all like working, working, working and so on, but at the time there was no internet, so we were able to clock out and leave and go, but work was still very important in Paramount. Now, with the internet coming right and with us being able to work from home and, like you said, get in the car, tether to your hotspot, get on the plane, you can actually have a completely uninterrupted time of working. Right, and when you think about your brain as also a muscle, what you're essentially doing is just constantly working your brain, and when I talk to my sister, I call it like my brain being parched, because, like, eventually, what happens is my brain starts to feel almost like I've dried it out and it's like desiccated. But I'll keep going because I don't do this anymore. But for years I would just keep going, keep working, and it's for some reason I thought that, well, the brain was an exempt muscle, right, or that's not, and I don't know what I was actually thinking, but whatever it was that was happening, the actions that I was taking were saying my mental health, my physical health, nothing is as important as getting this email out to someone.

Speaker 1: 6:54

So I feel like that's also something like to question when you say, like, why do we do that? It is. I asked them the other day. I said why are you on this earth? Are you on this earth to send that email? And they're like actually I'm not, but my kid needs me right now. I'm like, then, fucking, don't send the email and go talk to your kid.

Speaker 2: 7:12

And think about what you missed. That's your point, like that's what you're saying, so you're gonna miss a moment with your child to get the work done, or whatever the case may be. This was not that profound. I was in the taxi in Chicago when I was there a couple of weeks ago and I wasn't on my phone because I hadn't been back in a while. So you know and I love it the Lakeshore Drive, driving by Lake Michigan, all these memories. It was just a remarkable experience because I love the time that I lived there and I purposely didn't look at my phone and I took it all in and I'm like, okay, I remember this and I remember walking over here and I remember hanging out with my friends over here and when I trained for the marathon. I remember this spot and all this stuff and I would have missed all that. Think about what you're missing. Think about what you're missing.

Speaker 1: 7:59

And those feelings are so great. Right, because, like, when you look at your you know, because every time you saw it, you get your serotonin and your endorphins. You're like, oh yeah, right. But like, and on our phones which I don't have with me, just pretend this is my phone it's the dopamine hit. You know that I'm looking for there's oh look, I did the work, I did the work.

Speaker 1: 8:16

There's also, I think, another element of it for many people which I think that at some point we've all, we've done enough emotional, mental work with therapists and coaches and so on, to be able to like divorce ourselves from this, but it does take a lot of work. Is this idea that you know we, the purpose of being resilient is so you can work more, right? Ultimately, all the things that we're doing is so that we can work more, and so I feel like that's. The other question is what are you being resilient for exactly? So actually, I'm curious about that as you were doing your research. Is there any question that you're asking is like what are we being resilient for?

Speaker 2: 8:48

You know it's interesting In this particular case. You know this company wants to train their employees how to be more resilient. So the question is well, do you want them to be resilient so they can thrive or do you want them to be resilient so they can work more? That's one question. Oh, I just had it. It was on the tip of my I just I just had it.

Speaker 1: 9:11

I hate it when that happens when you're like literally, the words are there.

Speaker 2: 9:15

That's what I'm like there's so much in my brain. Oh, so there's this book that I just bought. Of course, I forget the name of it and it's about. It's about aging. It's an Oprah book. I'll find it while we're talking.

Speaker 2: 9:30

But so what are you being resilient for, was your question. For me, it's so I can live longer, like at this point, I don't, I don't, I don't want to recover. I'm not trying, I'm not, I'm not focusing on on recovering so that I can work more, or so that, so that I can, you know, be there for my kids. I'm working on recovery because I want to take care of my body and my mind, because the older you get, the more you realize you don't, you can't make you. First of all, you don't have as much time to make it up. Second of all, your body starts behaving. Your body starts behaving the way it should, based on how you're treating it. So like when I was in my twenties, if I, if I, like you know, had a week you know whatever a week where I ate like I was on death row, I'd be like, okay, I'll have some tabcola and salad for three days and I'll lose 10 pounds and everything will be fine, I'll be back to normal. I can't do that anymore and the more crap I put in my body or the more sleep that I lose because I was binging on Netflix, that I'm never going to get that sleep back. And it affects me even more the older I get.

Speaker 2: 10:38

So the recovery for me is about about being my best self, physically and mentally. I have to recover. I mean, you know, I had a friend that came to visit a couple of days ago and, for whatever reason, you know I go for a walk every morning and I didn't get my walk in and he showed up at noon and he said I want to go into town and I said so, I need to take my walk. You can have, if you want fun. You know, if you want fun, energetic, engaging Nancy, you'll go for this walk with me or you'll give me this time to go for the walk. If you want, nancy, that's going to be irritable, sluggish and and, like you know, caddy demand that I go into town with you, because I'm telling you right now, if I don't go for my walk it's going to affect me mentally and physically. So I kind of went down a rabbit hole there.

Speaker 2: 11:25

But I think that to me that's the importance. How am I going to thrive? And I know that I need to walk, or I know that I need to get sleep, or I know that I need to. You know, watch the junk food. If I've, if I've been having three or four days in a row of junk food, it's, it's the boundaries that you create with yourself that you don't keep, that you know you don't have the same, you don't have the same forgiveness that you had when you were in your twenties. You don't.

Speaker 1: 11:51

You, you know, I want to first say you said you went down a rabbit hole, but you kind of actually needed to go down that rabbit hole for me. That's why I needed to hear what you said. You had a script that you used where you were talking about your friend and you're saying okay, if you want to get this, Nancy, come on the walk with me. If you want to get this, Nancy and I actually have all I've struggled with it You're so good with scripts, Guys I should actually hold on. We got to just pull this out just to be on the safe side, because we're promoting it.

Speaker 1: 12:16

Yeah, okay, so good with scripts. This has got a lot of scripts in it. Guys, make sure you get Nancy's book. That's how I found her. But you know, because I have boundaries and then I'm bad about keeping them with myself for sure sometimes.

Speaker 1: 12:28

But then other times I'm also bad. I'm worse with it when there's someone else involved, because then I'll be like, well, I don't want to make them feel bad, I don't know how to say the thing, but like having that language that you just said, it's such great and it's so simple. When you said it I was like I was actually thinking to myself. I was like God, that's so simple. Why didn't I think of that? But you said it and I was like I'm so glad you said it, because now I have those words. I never would have thought of it, because I'm not very good at coming up with scripts, but I'm really good at using them when I have them. So thank you for going down that rabbit hole. But to your point about you know, being your body, not treating you the same way. It's so funny because when I was in you know, I was a bouncer at the Paradise for a couple of years.

Speaker 2: 13:08

Oh, my God, the Paradise.

Speaker 1: 13:09

Rock Club. Yes, I worked there for a couple of years. In fact, one of my dear friends, bill, is the manager there. It's fabulous. No-transcript.

Speaker 2: 13:19

Is it? This isn't Billy Bud, is it? Did you know, billy? Oh my god, you know.

Speaker 1: 13:22

Billy Bud too. Oh my god, I know it's not Billy Bud, but I freaking love Billy Bud.

Speaker 2: 13:27

Billy Bud has the seats next to me. I used to be his Patriot season ticket holder and he has the seats next to me.

Speaker 1: 13:33

You are kidding, that is so amazing, the Wildman.

Speaker 2: 13:37

I love him, that is what a small world.

Speaker 1: 13:38

I know right, he's great.

Speaker 2: 13:43

So, uh, this is you know what's small.

Speaker 1: 13:44

This is really I. Actually, this is one of the reasons why I love like I love having been in Boston for so long is that now we get to this space, this space where, like you can bring up somebody and someone else knows it, and I'm like damn, I really do, I do live here.

Speaker 1: 13:57

Yeah, um, but when I did work at the Paradise, uh, I mean I was a drunk, you know I drank all the time, partied all the time Like I mean I was. You know, you're in a rock club and I could easily dude. I would drink till God knows what time in the middle of the night and then drive home, wake up at five, go to work, and I could do this for four or five days in a row and, just you know, eat the McDonald's and recover and it's fine. Now, if I so much as wake up 30 minutes earlier than I need to, it's all over, it's so funny.

Speaker 2: 14:26

I saw this meme the other day. It's like the things you hated as a kid are now what you want the most, like sleep, healthy food. Like you know, naps right. It's so funny. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1: 14:41

I saw that meme that said like when I was younger I said I'm going to go to bed anytime I want, I'm going to keep my own bedtime and now that I'm older my bedtime is eight o'clock.

Speaker 2: 14:49

Me too, and that's one of my, you know. Um, I can't remember if we did it on the on the podcast podcast, if it was first this thrive list, which is what I pull out when I feel myself getting a little edgy or starting to feel overwhelmed, and I'm I'm actually going to print it out. It's bed by nine, like not sleeping, but in the bedroom by nine o'clock Eight o'clock is a bonus, but by nine o'clock upstairs my phone goes in the kitchen. I do not bring my phone into the bedroom with me and it's bed, but it just even just in the room. It could be like I'm reading a book, or I don't have a TV in my room either or chatting, you know, on the, not the phone, chatting with my husband or whatever, but that's one of the big ones. It's one of the big ones.

Speaker 1: 15:34

Can I ask you about this, cause I actually I you brought it. You did bring it up earlier when we were talking before the podcast and I I think it's it's such a great idea. I'm glad that you brought it up again. Can you tell me a little bit of what is this thrive list and how do you use it? Yeah?

Speaker 2: 15:48

I actually but shocking I have a tool for it, that that I'm happy to give you, that you can get to the two doors.

Speaker 2: 15:54

So, okay, Many years ago, for for the new year, my word was thrive and I made a vision board and it was awesome and thrive. The word thrive was in the middle of it. And then it all, all these pictures about what that meant to me. And it was in my office and every day I would walk by it and I loved it. Later that year coincidence maybe I was interviewed by thrive global magazine. Right, Like I mean that, like that's, I mean that's, like that's amazing, so it's, it's. What do I need to do? Thrive is I don't want to live, I want to thrive. I want to thrive on the road. I want to thrive at home, I want to thrive. So, and every year, the reason I'm telling you this is because every year I go to pick a new word and I never like my new word. I always go back to thrive, so I'm done.

Speaker 1: 16:41

Is that why you didn't?

Speaker 2: 16:42

pick a word this year. I couldn't, I couldn't buy. I'm like nothing is better than thrive. So then that is, I might even get a little necklace made or something like that, cause I love it. I just think it's such a great word. I just think it's such a great word Like you're not just, you're not just here, you're thriving. So when I, when I'm not thriving, when I'm feeling overwhelmed or stressed out, or I'm or I'm like snappy turtle or whatever I'm like, okay, I need to go back to what I know, that I do, my habits, my behaviors. That will get me back to who I am when I'm thriving.

Speaker 2: 17:17

So it could be journaling. Every day I make my own journal, I make my own journal and I print it out at FedEx and I, you know, I I make it and I might change it based on what's going on in my life for that month, but I do it every month. It could be, you know, something as simple as a cup of turmeric tea, right Like that. That brings me down. There's something very soothing about the not chamomile, not one of the other ones. It's always this one turmeric tea. It's, it's the golden turmeric tea. I don't know if you've ever had it. It's good, I have not, but I love turmeric, so that's great. It could be, you know, and it's nothing big, it could be.

Speaker 2: 17:52

Watch a sunrise, watch a sunset. I'm trying to think of what else. Is it early to bed, drinking water, you know? So I'll be like okay, and I it's literally a list and it's typed up. I mean I could pull it up right now. I'll try to find it, but and I pull it out and I'm like, okay, pick, pick three things from this list today, or pick one thing from this list today, or, you know, put it. You know, maybe whoops, sorry, just dropped my mic. Maybe it's something that's not very thrive-ish, maybe it's something as simple as okay. If you can't do any of these things today, at least have it on your desk, at least have it on your desk, so there's an awareness around it.

Speaker 2: 18:35

I can't find it. I'm not going to keep trying to do it so. So what I did was I don't know if you can, there's this big thing up on my screen right now.

Speaker 1: 18:44

I can't see the big thing, but I'm assuming it means you can't see me anymore and so it's like weird, because you're talking to a you know we're back and we're back.

Speaker 2: 18:54

So what I did was I put together a. It's just a. It's a sheet of paper and at the top it says thrive list and then there's number one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, 10. So if somebody wants it, I give it. You know, I give it out. It's free, obviously. I'm like just download it, create your own. I do a, I do a workshop called thriving in a hybrid environment, and that's what we do. Is I say what are the things that like? I'll ask you what, what do you do that brings you back to your best self.

Speaker 1: 19:25

You know, while you were talking, I was thinking about it because this list is so good. I was already thinking about, like what are the things I put on this list for myself? And one of them is and is going outside and taking like a really because I live right by the water taking like a really deep inhale and like doing like a bunch of breaths where I'm really breathing, because I find that when I'm not thriving, I'm in my body a lot and I can feel everything just feels unpleasant. So that's my. That's the first one. I think the other one would probably be snuggling with my dog Like that's a really good one doing a snuggling with my dog or with my wife, like either they both smell really good and then like and I'm very pheromone driven, so like having those pheromones like really calms me down. It's the smell Like, and then the reason I brought that up is because it's not just cuddling. I have to like inhale you know, there, there and it's like, okay, there's safety there.

Speaker 1: 20:11

So a lot of smelling. I guess there's a lot of smelling involved in my life, yeah, so I'm very sensitive we're learning about me.

Speaker 2: 20:18

Today it feels like you're my therapist Happy to help, happy to help, but you know, you know, breathing is, I don't. I don't even think it's on, I don't think breathing is, but meditation is yeah. So, you know, during COVID, during the quarantine, I was the most peaceful, calm and centered that I have ever been in my entire life, and some of that, of course, was that there was literally no demands on me, none Like I couldn't leave the house, but some of it was every morning and every night I did a meditation. You know it was a guided meditation. I did yoga every day. You know it was. You know I was walking around in nature. It was all the stuff that you know you should do, but you don't make the time to do. I had all the time to do it.

Speaker 2: 21:07

So you know, I want to get back to that. I want to get back to. I was so thriving in the middle of this pandemic that you know I want to get back to it. I want to get back to some of those things. Obviously, I have a life and I have to. I have commitments, but that's the other thing I do. By the way, one of the things on my thrive list is cancel some appointments because I over schedule, that is so good, that is a really good one.

Speaker 1: 21:40

Oh, my God, I that one's going on my list, because that's something that people. So actually I'm curious, right? Because, Nancy, you also probably have the same problem at a certain level, or or not like level, but like at a certain stage of your career. Everybody wants to talk to you all the time and you always have appointments, you always have. There's just always stuff happening and and like and there's a desire to do that, but it but there's a but. There's a difficulty, I think, in terms of like we can give all of ourselves away until there's like nothing left. Now I'm going to the doctor and I've got to meet with this person, I've got a podcast and I've got this right and like now it's just nonstop. So I'm curious to know, like, how does one balance?

Speaker 2: 22:19

How do you balance that. So I don't take any meetings on Fridays or Mondays. Okay, I just don't. That's a good one, that's a hard boundary that I will not break. Okay, so Mondays I call it mindset. Monday I won't. I don't.

Speaker 2: 22:33

I didn't leave my corporate job. Now I have the luxury of doing that because I work for myself. I didn't leave my corporate job to get up Monday morning and start grinding. Like I want to ease into my week and the best way I can do that is to have a free day where I can say okay, what are my priorities for the week? You know, blah, blah, blah. What you know blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

Speaker 2: 22:53

Fridays every now, and then I'll have a meeting on a Friday. But again, I didn't, I didn't build my business to be grinding Friday so that then I like leave my desk in a huff because it's the weekend and I come back and it's a shit show, or I, or I'm thinking about it all weekend. So that's one thing I do. You know, frankly, tuesdays, wednesdays, thursdays, I'm over. I'm right now, I'm over scheduled. But I have an awareness, like and we were talking about this earlier I know I'm over scheduled now, so I'll probably block some pockets of time next week so people can't book appointments with me. I'll get back to blocking some time out. I canceled an appointment for tomorrow. I canceled. I asked for a little bit of a lag. Today I was late for a call. I said can we start this call 10 minutes later because I needed those 10 minutes. You know it's it's it's it's tough, it's it's self inflicted. I'm in charge of my own time. So what's my problem?

Speaker 1: 23:56

Do you feel bad when you so like? You know, if you're like cause, like I, really one of the things again that this is, and every time you sometimes words will come out of your mouth and I'm like this is why I love her so much Right, it's like it's because you have very good boundary language. You have really good boundary language and like in, in not just boundary language, in like like scripts, but in ways that help me to like reframe it, the way that I think about something. Right? So for me, when you're like I'm going to be 10 minutes late, or like um, you know, I have to cancel appointments. If I was to do that, I would feel, oh, I'm letting that person down and blah, blah, blah, blah. Like there's a story in my head. Can I ask you what story that you tell?

Speaker 2: 24:34

Yes, so the story that I tell is they're not going to care and in fact they might want the time back too. Yeah, usually, usually if I'm like hey, I know we had a call set, like, let's say today hey, I know we had a call set up. I'm not at my best and I think it'd be a lot better if we moved it to next week. Wouldn't you be psyched to have an hour back in your day? Oh, yeah, totally. And you know what?

Speaker 1: 24:58

That's so true. I've never once said to anyone, or no one has ever said to me, I need to cancel, and maybe, like God, you're such an asshole. It's always like, thank God, I have an hour back. Oh shit, I would have enjoyed talking to you, but you know what? I'll talk to you next week. Then, right Like it's, it's not a thing for me, but when I do it, I talk to you. When I do it, I turn it into a thing for me. So I think the key is to to like flip that script and recognize that just because I'm doing it doesn't change the nature of it. It's still the same, nobody cares, it's fine.

Speaker 2: 25:23

Well, nobody cares, and you're doing them a disservice if you show up half-assed. So that's good.

Speaker 2: 25:32

And I have said things like you know what? I have a lot going on and my head's not in the game. You know, I think it would be better if we postponed it. This is on me. I want to show up the best that I can for you, and that's just not going to happen this week. And they're like great, thank you. They respect it, they're grateful, like well, thank you. Like have you ever been in a call with someone and you're like why do they have a bug up their ass? Like great. Or why are they even here, right? Like, and it wasn't. I'm sure it had nothing to do with you. I'm sure that they had a more thing's going on, maybe you know. So it's. It's more about again thriving and being at your best. Yeah, and that means that I that I ask if we can move it. I mean, if I called you, would you have been mad?

Speaker 1: 26:14

No, no, if I'm like yeah, no, we deal, it's fine. In fact, I usually check 10 to 15 minutes beforehand to make sure, like yesterday somebody had a. I had a scheduled in. Some one of my podcast guests unfortunately had a tragedy in their family and I was like, and they felt so bad and I was like what is wrong? Don't feel bad, like this is totally fine, you know it's actually.

Speaker 1: 26:32

I want to actually throw something else out there because as you were talking, I was listening and what I heard was is in my mind was trust, the people that you work with, right, and it made me think to myself that I have worked hard, as you have, I would imagine, to surround yourself with the kind of people who will help you thrive, and so chances are that any of the people that you reach out to to say this will all be in that same mindset. So it'll be like no big deal. Let's say you had messaged me and I'm like Nancy, you are so unreliable. You would be like I am literally never talking to Vanessa again, like this is not someone I've wanted my life.

Speaker 2: 27:06

Well, and that's a good point, because I'm trying to think it is possible that let's say, today you could have been like, oh, you know what, nancy, I really wanted this to go out next week. This is the only time I have. And then I would probably say, okay, get your game face on Like you tried. It's not always gonna work. You tried and yes, because I trust you and I trust that if it was okay, you would have said no, let's do it next week. The only exception to that is usually if it's a client. I probably, you know, nine times out of 10, I wouldn't do that to a client. They're paying me and I need to respect that. And also, at the same time, I set really clear boundaries with my clients. So when I do a speaking gig this is interesting, so this is for consultants, coaches, speakers I will put in my contracts. You know, here's the speaking engagement. You know 90 minutes, you know 60 minutes.

Speaker 2: 28:01

Whatever Included is one one hour session to happen at least two weeks prior to the event. One one hour planning session or 30 minute planning session. And then when they say, hey, can we talk to you again and again, and again, and again and again, I'm like okay, guys, so we have one session, so let's focus on that and that's all I can commit to at this time, like as a coach, consultant or speaker, all you have is your time. So if you have somebody that isn't used to the process or doesn't really know how to do it, or isn't really organized or whatever might be going on at their company, you know that's unfortunate. I can't spend six hours pre-planning with you because that's money out of my pocket, right, and that's not what we agreed to.

Speaker 1: 28:51

And I think that you know and that makes a lot of sense. You're not, I've spoken with it. I, you know, in interviewing a bunch of speakers, you know you can. I think that one of the things that sort of sets season speakers apart is the ones who will put the boundaries around it. Because, like, I think that one of the things that can happen as a speaker is that, like, you're the expert, right, and I've hired you now to speak at my event, but wait, I have all these other things that I really need to know and as long as we're having this conversation, I may as well just throw these in there, right? So a conversation that's supposed to take an hour can take longer because we keep getting derailed because they're not sure how to do the thing.

Speaker 1: 29:23

So I think part of that has to be, like you're saying, recognizing when you're the expert and you have to be the one to set the boundaries. You know, I think here's what's interesting about that right, cause, like, we even raise in a culture that says the customer is always right. So what you just said actually I love more than anything in the world, because I don't believe the customer is always right and I believe that we are, that in many cases we're partnerships and we're working in a partnership and like, and so it's about mutual respect, not about me bending over for you, right. And so I think that how did you? Because? Were there times as part of your career, has this been a conversation that you've had with people about the boundary being like a I'm drawing a boundary, it's totally fine, but the mistaken belief that exists in many people's minds that because we're paying you money, you should really just say yes to everything we ask you to do have you ever had that circumstance, or have you ever had to coach somebody out of that circumstance?

Speaker 2: 30:19

I've had clients who speaking clients and coaching clients, who don't really honor that, and it's okay, because I'm not like I don't. I'm trying to think of how to say this. So if they send me 75 emails, I'll say I'll respond. I'll respond, or I'll say this is part of your planning process, Let me know who's gonna be running point, or something like that. Or I have a checklist that I send out ahead of time. So I've done it enough that, like, let's say, I'm hired for a gig and as part of the contract, I say part of this is a 30 minute pre-planning call, to happen at least two weeks prior to the event. Oh, you know what, I'll give you a better one.

Speaker 2: 31:14

If they wanna look at my deck and change it, Okay, because that used to happen and I will. I mean, I'm happy to go through kind of a general flow, but this is not your presentation, it's mine and you're hiring me for a reason. I wanna understand what's important to your company. I wanna know what you don't want me to say, because I won't, you know, obviously, and my energy and my experience and the essence of this program is what I'm going to do. So I have the creative rights, if you will to that. So I won't send it to them ahead of time. I won't. I'll review it with them.

Speaker 1: 31:53

I mean I'll send them ahead of time so that they can load it onto the onto the right right, but it's not like you're sending it to them to be like, hey, go through it and tell me all the things that you want me to do.

Speaker 2: 32:00

No, because that has happened to me and it happened when I was younger, in my speaking career, and they would send it back and say, can you change this? And I would change it then to be like, if you can change this, and I would be really frustrated. And I remember I was actually talking to my husband and he's like, well, who's speech is it? I'm like, yeah, it's fine. So you know, it's just. It's just. You know again, it's clear and kind right, like it's just setting the parameter, like yes, I will go through it with you, we'll go through it, you know, at least two weeks prior, so I can make all the changes. You'll get it. You know a few days ahead of time. I ask that you don't distribute it. You know, whatever the case is, you learn and then you build it into your agreement and you know that's, that's just what I do.

Speaker 1: 32:42

I love this. So I gotta tell you, like I didn't know where this you know cause. So, just so that everyone knows, nancy and I decided we wanted to do a podcast together. So she got on it and we just jumped on it and said, okay, let's record. And I did not expect, cause this is gonna be a goldmine for two things.

Speaker 1: 32:55

One, the resilient conversation was awesome in general. But you know I get a lot of questions, you know, from speakers and I'm sure you do as well, wanting to know stuff about logistics, and often you know, even when I've asked the questions I haven't necessarily known what the questions were that I needed to ask. But through this conversation you gave such a great sort of like if somebody is an up and coming speaker and trying to figure out how to figure out their process and that kind of thing, your blueprint for this area of it today was really, really helpful. Nancy, thank you so much. You're welcome.

Speaker 1: 33:26

Okay, so as we start to wrap up today, I wanted to make sure that I gave you the opportunity, just cause you have so much stuff going on you have. Let's remind everyone guys, if you have not bought this book, buy it. I have so many copies at my house that I just keep giving away to people, so I just keep buying them. So literally I put a lot of your books, nancy, so get the book so I don't have to give you a copy.

Speaker 2: 33:47

Can you tell them about how we met, about no, about when you went live, about my book? Do you remember?

Speaker 1: 33:54

Oh my gosh, that was so funny. So I okay. So I read the book and I fell in love with it and I think I became like really weird fan girl. Just gonna say I totally did, I'm a fan person and then I decided that this was important enough. So this is actually the first live I did about books and now I do lives about the books that I haven't impacted on my life because of this one. So I did a live and I'm not a lot talking about it and just out of nowhere, Nancy was on a plane. I mean, I didn't know she was on a plane, I didn't even know she was there and I'm talking about her and suddenly she fucking shows up in the comments and says, oh my God, and I'm like, oh my God, and I'm like I don't know that I can keep talking now, Like this is. I was like I'm such a fan.

Speaker 1: 34:31

I'm such a fan, this is so exciting, and I'm like, oh my God, she's gonna join in. This is great, it was so awesome. And then, but that gave me the opportunity to invite you to like, it gave me the boldness to be like dude, let's do a podcast, we're just all of it, I know right. So, guys, seriously, I have to say you really just have to seize the day, like when there is some. If there's something you love, share that.

Speaker 2: 34:50

You love it, because that's how we met Definitely and that's happened so many times in my life my business coach. Now I have a business coach who is amazing. I heard her on a podcast two years ago. She's a top 1% podcaster like in the world, like legit this is not like a bullshit metric, like she really is. She I heard her on a podcast, I reached out to her she answers all her own DMs and we ended up working together and we're still a year later. We're still working together.

Speaker 2: 35:19

Like you gotta do it. You have to take the chance Because, like I answer all my own DMs, of course, I love hearing from people. I love it.

Speaker 1: 35:27

So I love that. I love that you answered me. Do you have anything right now that is upcoming, that we want to share with the listeners, because I know everybody's fallen in love with you? And, by the way, don't forget, guys, to go listen to the other podcasts that we did with Nancy. I'll put it in the show notes, oh yeah, that was a good one.

Speaker 2: 35:42

What you got for us, nancy, that was a good one. So I have a retreat coming up About when will this air? Do you know, like you know what?

Speaker 1: 35:49

This will air probably in oh you know what, let's say early December.

Speaker 2: 35:54

Oh, okay, so I will have already done my retreat. I have a retreat that I did on Cape Cod in the fall.

Speaker 1: 36:02

How did it go, Nancy? How was it?

Speaker 2: 36:04

Fantastic, it was sold out. It was like amazing, awesome. So yeah, I mean I always have I do some private one-on-one coaching. It's an eight-week program and it's there's an application and the application really is because I want to make sure that whoever is investing in me and my expertise and in themselves that it's a good fit. So that I mean that's probably it right now. I, you know, in December, who knows, I'm gonna be who knows?

Speaker 1: 36:34

It's so true, I'm gonna be honest, it's so true I barely know what I'm doing next week. I'm still figuring out the rest of my life, but you know what I think? Actually the key here is to actually follow Nancy. Like, really, that's the key, because you'll probably be on again, but you want to follow Nancy and you want to keep an eye out for all the things that she's doing, because I'll tell you, this year my word of the year was supernova and I and I sign her right. It's just, it's been a good word and I wouldn't have had.

Speaker 1: 36:58

Like, the key to being a supernova or doing something big is you have to be able to speak up. You have to be able to say the words. You can't make an impact or have a different or do anything if you don't use your voice, and one of the things that I have always struggled with is using my voice and having the words. And this book changed my life here and you speak changed my life. So follow her at nancymedoffcom, right? Is that your URL, yup, nancymedoffcom? All of the links will be in the show notes. Thank you so much, nancy. You were amazing.

Speaker 2: 37:28

Thank you. You're amazing, you are a psychologist.

Speaker 1: 37:46

I tell you things. You make a list.